This is the most pro Elon slobber piece you've written.
I hate to quote George Bush the younger, but he was right in this case. "Too often we judge others by their worst examples, while judging ourselves by our best Intentions"
You are doing the reverse here. You see all of Elons actions/positions and call the action/position the "Evil Elon" while his intentions are the "Real Elon".
You obviously don't like that he killed the CR but you call the Evil Elon who "exists in the perfervid imaginations of his detractors" when we actually saw the real guy (not imaginary) kill it live in a week of CNN.
You rightly have written a dozen articles about the problems of China's rising manufacturing monopoly.
You have no problem believing that say the German government might privilege Chinese concerns over the national interest. Yet, it is somehow wacky to think that a single individual might be cynically altering legislation because the Chinese government have billions of dollars worth of leverage.
If this causes us to lose to China in a conventional war, does the fiscal side justification matter?
Reading the rest of this, I can't tell if this is supposed to be stealth argument. It makes a very strong case for Evil Elon being the real version by his actions, but contrasts that with "but he said he is a good guy".
At what point do his stated intentions stop mattering and his actions say more?
He helped get Trump elected and that's a bad thing. Perhaps an ...Evil thing? There are talented, skilled, and morally bad people. You can admire his skill as an industrialist and still realize he isn't actually publicly minded.
You do, but it seems like this is Hindenburg not liking the Communists in 1933. At some point, you have to stop pretending the laudable intention even matters, because the act itself is so bad.
One question. When before now has Musk shown any indication that he’s interested in anything but his abilities, his wealth, and his self-regard? It’s the same question one would have asked about Donald Trump before 2016 (and afterwards).
No one suddenly becomes concerned about the nation. If one has that mindset, it shows up pretty early in one’s life. And it does seem to me that concern for the nation is something you want in a government official at any level.
I thought it was pretty clear from the beginning that he is writing this as a hypothetical. Even if you thought that Elon was actually the way “Real Elon” is described and that nothing at all about “Evil Elon” is real, he’s pointing out that there’s very little evidence that believer could point to in favor of their theory.
I get that there is a bit of "But Brutus is an honorable man" going on here. The problem is his previous piece on Elon was also pretty laudatory without the ambiguity that exists here.
Noah is also celebrating the end of wokeness and progressive overreach when the "All of their concerns about oligarchy are totally justified" pops up. "
Honestly Elon just seems to be a fairly midwit, right wing, edgelord contrarian at his core, at least when it comes to politics. He seems to be a good CEO who builds things, makes money, manages organisations, and makes bets incredibly well…but like he just seems to want to trigger the libs when it comes to almost every one of his public opinions. Idk if it’s real or evil; it’s more like incredibly stupid.
How is removing 1000 pages of congressional backroom pork from a bill that was just supposed to keep the government open for a few months doing a favor for the PRC? If there’s something good in the pork package, then congress should do their jobs and pass that as separate small readable bills instead of cramming everything into one must pass bill with not enough time for reading before voting.
Isn't the point of the article that while it does the things you mention, it also does the thing where it makes Elon money and you could easily say Elon did it for either of those things.
They don't do that mainly because of Senate procedure. There's the filibuster and there's too much floor time devoted to nominations. The Senate has to sleep if nothing else, and they also have to go back to their states and raise money and so on. So there's just not enough time and enough bills that can pass with a simple majority to do it this way.
This is a house bill, not a senate bill. The house doesn’t have a filibuster or approve nominees.
Even in the senate, why is it better to combine lots of small, unrelated provisions into a big bill that needs to pass at once in a matter of days. Maybe you liked the provision to ‘crack down on junk fees’, but how is that relevant continuing current government spending for the next 3 months? And if it is a good idea, someone should make a separate bill for that, debate it or amend it and then vote on it and pass it or not based on that alone.
Senators are not overworked, they have huge staffs, and spend lots of time campaigning and going on media and talking about irrelevant topics. And if someone has a radical plan that only a small majority supports, like ending birthright citizenship, or outlawing gas usage nationwide, then the filibuster is an important tool to prevent these radical changes from happening.
It’s true that the House is dysfunctional for other reasons right now. But Congress has been doing this for a while. I'm claiming they’ll continue to until Senate procedure is changed — even if there’s a functional House majority we’d still see giant Christmas tree bills.
I’m also not claiming the Senate is overworked (boo hoo the poor Senators, feel their pain) — what I mean is that they work on the wrong things. Less time debating the nomination of the junior assistant undersecretary of Agriculture for cattle waste, more time debating legislation.
As for the filibuster: yes, it’s good at blocking legislation and wasting floor time. That’s a double-edged sword. Lots of ideas that could get 55 votes that can’t get 60, which is why people stick them into giant must-pass or reconciliation omnibus bills. If they could pass with 55 votes you wouldn’t need the giant omnibus bills.
Exactly. Noah’s Stanford is showing in this piece, and that’s *always* unbecoming. Nothing supports his assertion that “good Elon” is the real one except for wishful thinking by someone too inclined to see the tech industry and billionaires as good. I trust Noah for lots of stuff, especially the China-bashing, but you can’t trust a crypto guy when it comes to Elon Musk, who is *obviously* a bad dude and a Nazi.
Also, the part about how American policy works towards the interests of the middle class is positively unhinged. Do better, Noah. Get out of your bubble.
My first take on the piece is that it it allowed for objectivity to be read into current events and that's not a bad thing. Seeing the comments I can see how pissed off many are wrt Mump. I'm simply (highly) skeptical of the intentions of the dynamic duo but refuse to jump to worst case always.
Modest Proposal: If Trump and Musk don't break up before Jan 20, Dems should attend the inauguration wearing President Musk merch. Lots of big signs--Thank you President Musk! That includes red hats with MMAGA--Musk Makes America Great Again. Can't be good for Trump's blood pressure.
Agreed. Noah was too quick to dismiss Trump as his check but it's clear his ego won't tolerate being the 2nd most important person in his presidency. Just look at the side eye Trump gave him in the campaign trail when Elon tried to hog the attention.
I don’t think the Dems will be happier with an unleashed Trump rather than one tempered by Musk’s goals of GDP growth and increased government efficiency.
It's never pretty to see a relationship between two narcissists collapse. Would not be surprised if Musk "switches sides" (though he's technically always on Team Elon first).
What scares me the most about Musk is how impulsive he seems to be. He develops an opinion and then demands to have his way. No one gets to suggest any alternatives to him. Possibly, not even Trump.
I never liked Musk as a person - not since his TSLA stock manipulation tweets years ago. Loose cannon, egomaniac, no moral grounding. Of course I revere what he has done with Starlink and SpaceX and his ability to think big. His politics have never concerned me one way or the other - most everybody has politics.
However, someone working for the WH and put in charge of government efficiency/spending cuts has every reason to speak out about spending bills, just as a green energy czar (billionaire Kerry, say) or foreign policy advisor would speak out about bills in Congress relevant to their agenda. He is part of the entering government and has a brief (which may be brief- we’ll see). Everyone should take a chill pill and treat this like a Kerry speech at the WEF.
Of course, Musk is the nemesis of the left and clickbait for the media- they are amplifying all this for their own reasons, to motivate their own supporters.
The issue here is that Musk is doing what he always does: falling for Twitter clickbait
It’s a fair assertion to say that he should be concerned with spending bills as the government efficiency guy… so why did he consistently misrepresent what is in the bill?
He tweeted about 4 billion for RFK stadium. That was a lie. He tweeted about Congress increasing their salaries by 40%. It was actually 3.8%.
This is the main concern from the left about Musk - having seen his descent into Twitter addiction and right wing evolution - is that he is actually incredibly credulous and gullible. He believes everything he sees on his own website, even demonstrably false claims like those above.
Therefore, it is more than reasonable to be concerned when the worlds richest man, holding the biggest microphone, tries to shape government policy based on incomplete or false information gathered from his own website, which he then blasts to hundreds of millions of people who are inclined to believe the “business wunderkind”.
Everyone has politics? Yeah, sure but review the quote of Madison. Noah's point is that Tusk's wealth and his platform change Madison's well reasoned notion.
He has a deep lack of awareness of the impact of what he is doing that fits with his acknowledgment that he is on the autism spectrum. I don’t believe he is genuinely anti-Semitic but his initial failure to recognize his statements as such, they weren’t subtle, seems detached from reality. Similarly, the CR blowup is an outgrowth of his DOGE mindset, so he strikes out against a symbol of government wasteful spending and budgetary dysfunction but doesn’t notice that the cure doesn’t match the disease.
Thank you for your excellent comment! I think the adjective neurodivergent applies to him. He doesn't think the way most of us do or communicate the way most of us do, so he comes off as profoundly independent of the concerns of ordinary human beings.
Or, more simply, he lacks a filter. The problem with “neurodivergent” as a descriptor is that it lacks specificity; there are myriad ways for someone’s thinking to be atypical, so it doesn’t amount to more than a euphemism.
The reason why I'm stuck with neurodivergent is that I simply don't get Elon Musk. I can usually place the people I meet into a type of human being I have encountered before. Autism does not run in my family, and neither have I had many encounters with folks on that spectrum. So Musk comes off to me as pure terra incognita.
It's the nature of Narcissists. More specifically, those far enough along the spectrum with the five diagnostic criteria to qualify for NPD (Narcissist Personality Disorder).
If President Musk cannot resist the urge to keep outshining Vice-President Trump--as with that recent budget vote--then I fear all that he has invested in Trump, including a whopping $220 million in cash--will have been for naught. Trump will impose his massive China tariffs, China will retaliate against Tesla, and Elon's fortunes will diminish but not completely disappear.
I doubt China has the power to put Tesla out of business, since the Shanghai plant only supplies the China market and exports to Asia, and his other factories in Fremont, Austin and Berlin make more vehicles and Tesla makes their own batteries in Reno. Also, Elon has SpaceX which is valued highly for its income producing StarLink satellites and transceivers also made in America, and unrivaled space launch capability as well as X.ai which is also highly valued.
Google sez >50% of Tesla vehicles, and a higher % of their batteries, are produced in China. So, China could mess them up real bad if they want. My understanding is that from a p/e perspective, Tesla stock is bubbly and vulnerable to poppage if, say, most of its China supply chains suddenly ran afoul of health and safety regs.
This view is a bit too benign. All Putin supporters claim that what they are looking for is to end the bloodshed. Elon's claims against the spending package were misleading or open lies. Kara Swisher knows him well, and she is on the spot about the dangers of Elon
He is also asking for Scholz's resignation (because of the killings in Magdeburg), which makes me wonder - is he aware that Scholz already lost a vote of confidence, so he has technically resigned. I suppose Musk has no clue of how the German political system works, or maybe he thinks it is like the British one, where you can replace prime ministers at any time?
I mean, there is clearly no majority to form a new coalition in this Bundestag, and everyone wants a general election early next year, so what is really going on? Is the German government planning something that will hurt Musk's business? Or is Musk just trying to cause chaos in an allied country?
In any case, I would support the argument that this speaks more towards the "Evil Musk" option.
Please don't rely on the American press to tell you about EU politics. AfD is most definitively not a Nazi party any more than France's RN or Hungary's Fidesz. They are also not "far-Right"; RN and Fidesz even have further-right competition. The EU major-party Overton window is skewed considerably left of us. Anything to the right of a 1990's Democrat is "far-right" by EU standards.
Don't take my word for this. Just go look at their actual proposals. 90% of them sound like fairly standard American conservative positions, in some cases amplified by the cultural conflict Europe has experienced with Islam, a conflict that America has avoided since our immigrants are mostly sourced from other parts of the world.
Apparently you didn't get the memo though: Trump isn't Hitler anymore. Joe Biden had the Orange Man for tea and crumpets 3 days after the election and declared he was "looking forward to a successful transition". So wither Old-Joe became a fascist or it was all an act.
The websites are publicly available. If you really want to know what these parties stand for, just go read them. None of it is particularly out-there. Are there kooks in all of them? Sure. There are kooks (lots of them) in the Democratic and Republican parties too. But the policies of each party is actually pretty tame.
Apparently you didn’t get the memo. Peaceful transfer of power is a cornerstone of democracy. Is the fact that our current administration decent, law respecting people your proof that the incoming administration does not harbor fascist tendencies?
Also, I have a lot of family in Europe, they know BS when they see them. The websites are a very sugarcoated version of what they intent to do. They know their history.
What is you next point? “Hitler did a lot of good things too. Did you see his campaign points and policies?( He was elected after all.) They were very tame.”
I respect a healthy skepticism of politicians, but at some point, you have to decide: which of these parties actually believes in making my society better, in solving the problems we actually have.
If you really think AfD is a bunch of Nazis, you should encourage the left-wing parties you apparently do support to do something about crime and immigration, since those are the 2 issues driving support for AfD, RN, Fidesz, and Trump.
German chancellor is usually the product of a center leaning coalition.
As most parliamentary democracies the system randomly producers a single governing party, but that is a feature not a bug to those versed in democracy.
The least party to save the country is the noxious neo-nazi AfD.
Have we learned nothing from history? Germans turning to the right wing in periods of upheaval invariably has resulted in the worst conflict in world history.
Yes, Germans are quite new democracy, their experience mostly begins with WWII with a previous sad interlude with Weimar. The East of course is far less familiar with democracy.
the fact that we have a foreign born national who has inserted himself as the de-facto president next to an ineffectual old man is front and center the most 10-alarm emergency nightmare scenario for the founders; it could not be more exactly the single biggest thing they wished to prevent. The undermining of the founding vision of the United States in the most direct way since the Civil War is itself evil, so there should be a lot more people than just "a few progressives" who are 100% sure Elon is fully evil. It doesn't matter what the guy thinks, his actions are directly evil just in manner alone. "Evil" is not an intent, it's an action.
I know you don't like "heated language" so I figured I'd do the job for you :)
I have learned a lot from your brilliant and original posts but I think the style of this post and your recent one on health insurers does not serve you well. I think you fail to recognize the power of media and money in this situation. Fox News played a much bigger role in Trump’s recent razor thin triumph. They did not need to have overwhelming influence in American politics as you fear but only enough to put someone like Trump over the top to gain substantial control of US politics. Their omission in reporting was even more potent than their lies to portray their candidate as a viable choice for president. Media in its modern form- social media rather than broadcast media has yet to reveal its mighty power IMO but it will soon, as its influence grows beyond the 30’s and younger ( as we all age). With Citizens United we have shown that we do not have the checks and balances we need to hold oligarchs at bay - and that was before we had the current Trump SCOTUS. Opponents of authoritarianism need to realize the threat - you do not seem to in these two cases as you down play it in your recent posts.
Citizens United only served to give all oligarchs the special power previously reserved only for the particular oligarchs that owned media companies. It's much more democratic now.
The idea of a Real Elon vs an Evil Elon is a good way to try and sort out his behavior and motivations. To that I’d add that he’s not the first business leader to confuse his self interest with the public’s, consciously or not.
Elon is, at bottom, an engineer with a lot of money who thinks his stupefying wealth entitles him to a seat at the head of the table. He seems to think that his money and access give him political leverage and acumen no one else has. What he’s starting to find out is that government reform is a political project, not an engineering one. He’s as naive as Trump has been about how difficult our system of competing interest groups makes it to get anything done without a real mandate. The incoming administration claims one, but that isn’t supported by the electoral results. Although the GOP (Trump) will soon control all 3 branches, we’re already seeing cracks in this supposed monolith. Musk’s notion of reform by waving the magic wand of X or having the ear of a senescent president is starting to collide with reality, as the current turmoil over the CR shows.
Musk may know tech. He doesn’t know politics. It’s also laughable that he’s threatened to primary those who cross him because here’s someone who could never win an election on his own, given his awkward public identity and his controversial and clumsily expressed opinions.
I vehemently disagree with Noah’s close that “well actually what Elon is doing is democratic because nobody is forced to use Twitter or believe him”
This is, of course, after he acknowledges that musk has his finger on the scale when it comes to boosting him and his friends. It’s not really a true free and equal marketplace of ideas when some ideas are more equal than others..
Americans are one of the most highly propagandized populations in the world, and the average Twitter user is not going to be fact checking Elon. Therefore, the consent of the government is irrelevant when the governed are constantly bombarded by outright falsehoods or misinformation blasted to them by the world’s biggest microphone.
This reads like you’re trying to balance your influence with rich people in the tech community who like Elon while hedging your bets as Musk has become increasingly deranged and extreme in his antics. We can all agree with you that Spacex and Tesla are great, but his unmitigated embrace of far-right politics is hitting the pointing where there’s no need to qualify criticisms and deep distrust of him. It’s up to him to prove that his intentions are good, he doesn’t deserve the benefit of the doubt anymore.
The Left's sudden obsession with Elon is really weird. Elon Musk is NOT "making critical decisions about the United States". He is not making ANY govt decisions at all. Even as the head of DOGE (stupid acronym for a stupid idea) he will not have any official power. Elon Musk is an advisor; presidential advisors (incl wealthy ones) are nothing new.
"Elon spent $250M to get Trump elected" -- oh heavens to Betsy, what will he get for that money?
George Soros (another billionaire) spent $500M+ in 2018 and 2019, mostly to elect local DAs. What did he get for his money? The disaster that was "defund the police" -- what, you thought that idea was totally organic and grassroots? Astroturf backed by political violence.
Let's not even talk about the Pritzkers. Oh, you thought the "men can get pregnant" thing was organic too? That America suddenly forget basic biology in the last 5 years entirely spontaneously? Astroturf backed with economic and social violence.
Noah, tell me again about all those studies that show American policy reflects the will of the middle-class? What if the middle-class just mirrors (either by emulation or coercion) the lunatic policy preferences of the oligarchy?
The Left is just upset the Right finally has someone with deep pockets willing to defend the country instead of tear it apart for a change.
On a practical level, is anyone actually upset that Elon's whining took a 1500 page bill laden with giveaways and bennies down to a simple 100 page bill that just funds the government? He didn't even succeed; Trump's debt limit extension got cut too.
Agree, the show on X is just perpetual self-agitation and self-high-fiving of Muskovites that has little relevance in the real world. I doubt even 5% of them called their senators as they claim they did.
The thing that worries me though is that many of Musk supporters cheer whenever Elon says something in a spirit of "all branches of government should align with president". This seems like an empirical confirmation that middle class mirrors preferences of oligarchy. But that means that some kind of a check on oligarchs is needed.
Frankly Dr Smith, you are forgetting your American history and missing the obvious. The United States grappled with the equivalent problem between the 1890s and the Great Depression. Back then, the Elons of the world were, correctly, labelled the "Robber Barons". This they were, and the fact that they began, or financed, or exploited, the industrialization and commercialization of the United States, and thus stimulated the great expansion in economic growth and mass prosperity after about the mid-1870s. But they were, collectively, also malevolent bullies who tried to run the country, shifting it in reactionary directions and fostering a particularly nasty triumphalist creed we then called "Social Darwinism". And breaking their power, or a major and public portion of it, was a pre-requisite for the advance of American progress. Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, the Progressive Era and the aggressive use of the antitrust laws was the first salvo, and FDR and the New Deal finished the job, albeit only after the massive and tragic capital destruction of the Great Depression put them on the defensive.
Musk is just the most recent and malignant manifestation of the recurrence of the Robber Barons in American life. Same Social Darwinism and utter indifference to the fate of those less fortunate, although here inflected by an unhealthy dose of vicious Caesarism (thank you, Moldbug) that should frighten any defender of democracy and some particular apartheid-era-South-Africa-flavored baasskap (Google it) philosophy applied to the modern U.S. At least the first-wave Robber Barons built universities and small-town libraries. Social stability is a positive good; "move fast and break things" doesn't work when you're talking about the many major government functions which exist, on the basis of the hard lessons of history, to stabilize society and protect those less able to deploy government favor to protect themselves.
None of this is a new story, although it is deeply dispiriting that the U.S. is apparently going to have to learn again all the lessons of 1890-1965, and that this problem doesn't appear to be clear to someone as bright as Noah Smith.
Elon Musk wouldn’t be chummy with Putin if he wanted stability in Europe.
Trump, who knew about the original CR, clearly approved it. It seems as if Elon went freelancing.
Musk has far more money than Trump. That alone probably bothers Trump. The fact that Elon exercised the power that Trump usually uses will bother Trump.
Trump has created a monster. The wealthiest man in the world has a new toy. Politics. He now imagines he has real power. Something else that Trump will tire of is Musk usurping his power and headlines.
What will happen with a scorned Musk? Bad twitter? I see a big crash between the two coming, and Trump would be wise to figure out how to settle Elon down. Trump and Elon have learned it is hard to herd cats.
The Muskrat aside, I think that Noah’s comments about oligarchy in the US are blindfolded by not including corporations in the equation. Since our esteemed judiciary regards corporations as individuals, isn’t it more realistic to be concerned about an oligarchy that includes both individuals AND corporations and, I think, that’s a very real concern regarding our future. How much of our healthcare cost quagmire, for example, can be attributed to corporations that defend the status quo against attempts at reform? How much of our bloated defense budget is a result of corporate muckraking behind closed doors? Examples are endless.
This is the most pro Elon slobber piece you've written.
I hate to quote George Bush the younger, but he was right in this case. "Too often we judge others by their worst examples, while judging ourselves by our best Intentions"
You are doing the reverse here. You see all of Elons actions/positions and call the action/position the "Evil Elon" while his intentions are the "Real Elon".
You obviously don't like that he killed the CR but you call the Evil Elon who "exists in the perfervid imaginations of his detractors" when we actually saw the real guy (not imaginary) kill it live in a week of CNN.
You rightly have written a dozen articles about the problems of China's rising manufacturing monopoly.
You have no problem believing that say the German government might privilege Chinese concerns over the national interest. Yet, it is somehow wacky to think that a single individual might be cynically altering legislation because the Chinese government have billions of dollars worth of leverage.
If this causes us to lose to China in a conventional war, does the fiscal side justification matter?
Reading the rest of this, I can't tell if this is supposed to be stealth argument. It makes a very strong case for Evil Elon being the real version by his actions, but contrasts that with "but he said he is a good guy".
At what point do his stated intentions stop mattering and his actions say more?
He helped get Trump elected and that's a bad thing. Perhaps an ...Evil thing? There are talented, skilled, and morally bad people. You can admire his skill as an industrialist and still realize he isn't actually publicly minded.
I am baffled by this piece.
SLOBBER
He voiced his support for Alternative for Deutschland on Friday.
I talk about that in the post! Check it out!
You do, but it seems like this is Hindenburg not liking the Communists in 1933. At some point, you have to stop pretending the laudable intention even matters, because the act itself is so bad.
One question. When before now has Musk shown any indication that he’s interested in anything but his abilities, his wealth, and his self-regard? It’s the same question one would have asked about Donald Trump before 2016 (and afterwards).
No one suddenly becomes concerned about the nation. If one has that mindset, it shows up pretty early in one’s life. And it does seem to me that concern for the nation is something you want in a government official at any level.
I thought it was pretty clear from the beginning that he is writing this as a hypothetical. Even if you thought that Elon was actually the way “Real Elon” is described and that nothing at all about “Evil Elon” is real, he’s pointing out that there’s very little evidence that believer could point to in favor of their theory.
I get that there is a bit of "But Brutus is an honorable man" going on here. The problem is his previous piece on Elon was also pretty laudatory without the ambiguity that exists here.
Noah is also celebrating the end of wokeness and progressive overreach when the "All of their concerns about oligarchy are totally justified" pops up. "
Honestly Elon just seems to be a fairly midwit, right wing, edgelord contrarian at his core, at least when it comes to politics. He seems to be a good CEO who builds things, makes money, manages organisations, and makes bets incredibly well…but like he just seems to want to trigger the libs when it comes to almost every one of his public opinions. Idk if it’s real or evil; it’s more like incredibly stupid.
He's not the stupid one.
He's not stupid; my point is that his twitter is, and his social media politics entering real life policymaking is beyond stupid.
How is removing 1000 pages of congressional backroom pork from a bill that was just supposed to keep the government open for a few months doing a favor for the PRC? If there’s something good in the pork package, then congress should do their jobs and pass that as separate small readable bills instead of cramming everything into one must pass bill with not enough time for reading before voting.
Isn't the point of the article that while it does the things you mention, it also does the thing where it makes Elon money and you could easily say Elon did it for either of those things.
They don't do that mainly because of Senate procedure. There's the filibuster and there's too much floor time devoted to nominations. The Senate has to sleep if nothing else, and they also have to go back to their states and raise money and so on. So there's just not enough time and enough bills that can pass with a simple majority to do it this way.
Reform the Senate!
This is a house bill, not a senate bill. The house doesn’t have a filibuster or approve nominees.
Even in the senate, why is it better to combine lots of small, unrelated provisions into a big bill that needs to pass at once in a matter of days. Maybe you liked the provision to ‘crack down on junk fees’, but how is that relevant continuing current government spending for the next 3 months? And if it is a good idea, someone should make a separate bill for that, debate it or amend it and then vote on it and pass it or not based on that alone.
Senators are not overworked, they have huge staffs, and spend lots of time campaigning and going on media and talking about irrelevant topics. And if someone has a radical plan that only a small majority supports, like ending birthright citizenship, or outlawing gas usage nationwide, then the filibuster is an important tool to prevent these radical changes from happening.
It’s true that the House is dysfunctional for other reasons right now. But Congress has been doing this for a while. I'm claiming they’ll continue to until Senate procedure is changed — even if there’s a functional House majority we’d still see giant Christmas tree bills.
I’m also not claiming the Senate is overworked (boo hoo the poor Senators, feel their pain) — what I mean is that they work on the wrong things. Less time debating the nomination of the junior assistant undersecretary of Agriculture for cattle waste, more time debating legislation.
As for the filibuster: yes, it’s good at blocking legislation and wasting floor time. That’s a double-edged sword. Lots of ideas that could get 55 votes that can’t get 60, which is why people stick them into giant must-pass or reconciliation omnibus bills. If they could pass with 55 votes you wouldn’t need the giant omnibus bills.
Exactly. Noah’s Stanford is showing in this piece, and that’s *always* unbecoming. Nothing supports his assertion that “good Elon” is the real one except for wishful thinking by someone too inclined to see the tech industry and billionaires as good. I trust Noah for lots of stuff, especially the China-bashing, but you can’t trust a crypto guy when it comes to Elon Musk, who is *obviously* a bad dude and a Nazi.
Also, the part about how American policy works towards the interests of the middle class is positively unhinged. Do better, Noah. Get out of your bubble.
My first take on the piece is that it it allowed for objectivity to be read into current events and that's not a bad thing. Seeing the comments I can see how pissed off many are wrt Mump. I'm simply (highly) skeptical of the intentions of the dynamic duo but refuse to jump to worst case always.
Modest Proposal: If Trump and Musk don't break up before Jan 20, Dems should attend the inauguration wearing President Musk merch. Lots of big signs--Thank you President Musk! That includes red hats with MMAGA--Musk Makes America Great Again. Can't be good for Trump's blood pressure.
Don't miss this:
https://www.threads.net/@ashariartistry/post/DD5r9VcOcQM?xmt=AQGzfaxfqL9rpRny4nFPtsIwIHLCFl1ruuyKZcaLySl3Eg
Agreed. Noah was too quick to dismiss Trump as his check but it's clear his ego won't tolerate being the 2nd most important person in his presidency. Just look at the side eye Trump gave him in the campaign trail when Elon tried to hog the attention.
I don’t think the Dems will be happier with an unleashed Trump rather than one tempered by Musk’s goals of GDP growth and increased government efficiency.
I confidently expect Trump to trashcan Elon soon. Maybe even arrest him and loot his companies.
EDIT: Just a few minutes after I wrote this, Trump dissed Elon on Truth Social.
Link about the Truth Social thing?
It's never pretty to see a relationship between two narcissists collapse. Would not be surprised if Musk "switches sides" (though he's technically always on Team Elon first).
What scares me the most about Musk is how impulsive he seems to be. He develops an opinion and then demands to have his way. No one gets to suggest any alternatives to him. Possibly, not even Trump.
I never liked Musk as a person - not since his TSLA stock manipulation tweets years ago. Loose cannon, egomaniac, no moral grounding. Of course I revere what he has done with Starlink and SpaceX and his ability to think big. His politics have never concerned me one way or the other - most everybody has politics.
However, someone working for the WH and put in charge of government efficiency/spending cuts has every reason to speak out about spending bills, just as a green energy czar (billionaire Kerry, say) or foreign policy advisor would speak out about bills in Congress relevant to their agenda. He is part of the entering government and has a brief (which may be brief- we’ll see). Everyone should take a chill pill and treat this like a Kerry speech at the WEF.
Of course, Musk is the nemesis of the left and clickbait for the media- they are amplifying all this for their own reasons, to motivate their own supporters.
The issue here is that Musk is doing what he always does: falling for Twitter clickbait
It’s a fair assertion to say that he should be concerned with spending bills as the government efficiency guy… so why did he consistently misrepresent what is in the bill?
He tweeted about 4 billion for RFK stadium. That was a lie. He tweeted about Congress increasing their salaries by 40%. It was actually 3.8%.
This is the main concern from the left about Musk - having seen his descent into Twitter addiction and right wing evolution - is that he is actually incredibly credulous and gullible. He believes everything he sees on his own website, even demonstrably false claims like those above.
Therefore, it is more than reasonable to be concerned when the worlds richest man, holding the biggest microphone, tries to shape government policy based on incomplete or false information gathered from his own website, which he then blasts to hundreds of millions of people who are inclined to believe the “business wunderkind”.
Everyone has politics? Yeah, sure but review the quote of Madison. Noah's point is that Tusk's wealth and his platform change Madison's well reasoned notion.
He has a deep lack of awareness of the impact of what he is doing that fits with his acknowledgment that he is on the autism spectrum. I don’t believe he is genuinely anti-Semitic but his initial failure to recognize his statements as such, they weren’t subtle, seems detached from reality. Similarly, the CR blowup is an outgrowth of his DOGE mindset, so he strikes out against a symbol of government wasteful spending and budgetary dysfunction but doesn’t notice that the cure doesn’t match the disease.
Thank you for your excellent comment! I think the adjective neurodivergent applies to him. He doesn't think the way most of us do or communicate the way most of us do, so he comes off as profoundly independent of the concerns of ordinary human beings.
Or, more simply, he lacks a filter. The problem with “neurodivergent” as a descriptor is that it lacks specificity; there are myriad ways for someone’s thinking to be atypical, so it doesn’t amount to more than a euphemism.
The reason why I'm stuck with neurodivergent is that I simply don't get Elon Musk. I can usually place the people I meet into a type of human being I have encountered before. Autism does not run in my family, and neither have I had many encounters with folks on that spectrum. So Musk comes off to me as pure terra incognita.
Oh everyone thinks they’re on the autism spectrum these days
Neurodivergent is a way too sympathetic way to describe “narcissistic asshole”
He’s too eugenics-y to be actually anti-Semitic, but he’s definitely racist. It comes from his heritage.
It's the nature of Narcissists. More specifically, those far enough along the spectrum with the five diagnostic criteria to qualify for NPD (Narcissist Personality Disorder).
If President Musk cannot resist the urge to keep outshining Vice-President Trump--as with that recent budget vote--then I fear all that he has invested in Trump, including a whopping $220 million in cash--will have been for naught. Trump will impose his massive China tariffs, China will retaliate against Tesla, and Elon's fortunes will diminish but not completely disappear.
I doubt China has the power to put Tesla out of business, since the Shanghai plant only supplies the China market and exports to Asia, and his other factories in Fremont, Austin and Berlin make more vehicles and Tesla makes their own batteries in Reno. Also, Elon has SpaceX which is valued highly for its income producing StarLink satellites and transceivers also made in America, and unrivaled space launch capability as well as X.ai which is also highly valued.
Google sez >50% of Tesla vehicles, and a higher % of their batteries, are produced in China. So, China could mess them up real bad if they want. My understanding is that from a p/e perspective, Tesla stock is bubbly and vulnerable to poppage if, say, most of its China supply chains suddenly ran afoul of health and safety regs.
Sad that I would actually cheer that, but I’d rather have just 1 narcissistic douchebag running the government than 2
It’s the drug addiction. Ketamine does that to you.
This view is a bit too benign. All Putin supporters claim that what they are looking for is to end the bloodshed. Elon's claims against the spending package were misleading or open lies. Kara Swisher knows him well, and she is on the spot about the dangers of Elon
The real Elon Musk tweeted that only the AdF (modern nazi party) can save Germany.
Keep putting lipstick on a pig. I take that back; it is too insulting to pigs.
It's AfD. Anyway, didn't you read the post?
I always type it wrong. Thanks for fixing the typo.
Which post are you referring to? If Musk's, it was a one-liner.
It wasn't a joke. It is now covered by most newspapers.
He is also asking for Scholz's resignation (because of the killings in Magdeburg), which makes me wonder - is he aware that Scholz already lost a vote of confidence, so he has technically resigned. I suppose Musk has no clue of how the German political system works, or maybe he thinks it is like the British one, where you can replace prime ministers at any time?
I mean, there is clearly no majority to form a new coalition in this Bundestag, and everyone wants a general election early next year, so what is really going on? Is the German government planning something that will hurt Musk's business? Or is Musk just trying to cause chaos in an allied country?
In any case, I would support the argument that this speaks more towards the "Evil Musk" option.
You vastly overestimate how much Americans know about the German (or any country other than the US) political system.
Please don't rely on the American press to tell you about EU politics. AfD is most definitively not a Nazi party any more than France's RN or Hungary's Fidesz. They are also not "far-Right"; RN and Fidesz even have further-right competition. The EU major-party Overton window is skewed considerably left of us. Anything to the right of a 1990's Democrat is "far-right" by EU standards.
Don't take my word for this. Just go look at their actual proposals. 90% of them sound like fairly standard American conservative positions, in some cases amplified by the cultural conflict Europe has experienced with Islam, a conflict that America has avoided since our immigrants are mostly sourced from other parts of the world.
How nice of you to mention that all the European Nazi parties that you mentioned are incredibly similar to our GOP.
Funny that you presented the US right-of-center press as a left-of-center narrative.
For a second, I read your byline as Parasitic Protestantism. Oops. My bad.
Apparently you didn't get the memo though: Trump isn't Hitler anymore. Joe Biden had the Orange Man for tea and crumpets 3 days after the election and declared he was "looking forward to a successful transition". So wither Old-Joe became a fascist or it was all an act.
The websites are publicly available. If you really want to know what these parties stand for, just go read them. None of it is particularly out-there. Are there kooks in all of them? Sure. There are kooks (lots of them) in the Democratic and Republican parties too. But the policies of each party is actually pretty tame.
Apparently you didn’t get the memo. Peaceful transfer of power is a cornerstone of democracy. Is the fact that our current administration decent, law respecting people your proof that the incoming administration does not harbor fascist tendencies?
Also, I have a lot of family in Europe, they know BS when they see them. The websites are a very sugarcoated version of what they intent to do. They know their history.
What is you next point? “Hitler did a lot of good things too. Did you see his campaign points and policies?( He was elected after all.) They were very tame.”
I respect a healthy skepticism of politicians, but at some point, you have to decide: which of these parties actually believes in making my society better, in solving the problems we actually have.
If you really think AfD is a bunch of Nazis, you should encourage the left-wing parties you apparently do support to do something about crime and immigration, since those are the 2 issues driving support for AfD, RN, Fidesz, and Trump.
Who can save Germany? Surely not the Greens.
German chancellor is usually the product of a center leaning coalition.
As most parliamentary democracies the system randomly producers a single governing party, but that is a feature not a bug to those versed in democracy.
The least party to save the country is the noxious neo-nazi AfD.
Have we learned nothing from history? Germans turning to the right wing in periods of upheaval invariably has resulted in the worst conflict in world history.
Yes, Germans are quite new democracy, their experience mostly begins with WWII with a previous sad interlude with Weimar. The East of course is far less familiar with democracy.
Surely not the Nazis
the fact that we have a foreign born national who has inserted himself as the de-facto president next to an ineffectual old man is front and center the most 10-alarm emergency nightmare scenario for the founders; it could not be more exactly the single biggest thing they wished to prevent. The undermining of the founding vision of the United States in the most direct way since the Civil War is itself evil, so there should be a lot more people than just "a few progressives" who are 100% sure Elon is fully evil. It doesn't matter what the guy thinks, his actions are directly evil just in manner alone. "Evil" is not an intent, it's an action.
I know you don't like "heated language" so I figured I'd do the job for you :)
I have learned a lot from your brilliant and original posts but I think the style of this post and your recent one on health insurers does not serve you well. I think you fail to recognize the power of media and money in this situation. Fox News played a much bigger role in Trump’s recent razor thin triumph. They did not need to have overwhelming influence in American politics as you fear but only enough to put someone like Trump over the top to gain substantial control of US politics. Their omission in reporting was even more potent than their lies to portray their candidate as a viable choice for president. Media in its modern form- social media rather than broadcast media has yet to reveal its mighty power IMO but it will soon, as its influence grows beyond the 30’s and younger ( as we all age). With Citizens United we have shown that we do not have the checks and balances we need to hold oligarchs at bay - and that was before we had the current Trump SCOTUS. Opponents of authoritarianism need to realize the threat - you do not seem to in these two cases as you down play it in your recent posts.
Citizens United only served to give all oligarchs the special power previously reserved only for the particular oligarchs that owned media companies. It's much more democratic now.
The idea of a Real Elon vs an Evil Elon is a good way to try and sort out his behavior and motivations. To that I’d add that he’s not the first business leader to confuse his self interest with the public’s, consciously or not.
Elon is, at bottom, an engineer with a lot of money who thinks his stupefying wealth entitles him to a seat at the head of the table. He seems to think that his money and access give him political leverage and acumen no one else has. What he’s starting to find out is that government reform is a political project, not an engineering one. He’s as naive as Trump has been about how difficult our system of competing interest groups makes it to get anything done without a real mandate. The incoming administration claims one, but that isn’t supported by the electoral results. Although the GOP (Trump) will soon control all 3 branches, we’re already seeing cracks in this supposed monolith. Musk’s notion of reform by waving the magic wand of X or having the ear of a senescent president is starting to collide with reality, as the current turmoil over the CR shows.
Musk may know tech. He doesn’t know politics. It’s also laughable that he’s threatened to primary those who cross him because here’s someone who could never win an election on his own, given his awkward public identity and his controversial and clumsily expressed opinions.
Jefferson's phrase "the consent of the governed" seems relevant here.
I vehemently disagree with Noah’s close that “well actually what Elon is doing is democratic because nobody is forced to use Twitter or believe him”
This is, of course, after he acknowledges that musk has his finger on the scale when it comes to boosting him and his friends. It’s not really a true free and equal marketplace of ideas when some ideas are more equal than others..
Americans are one of the most highly propagandized populations in the world, and the average Twitter user is not going to be fact checking Elon. Therefore, the consent of the government is irrelevant when the governed are constantly bombarded by outright falsehoods or misinformation blasted to them by the world’s biggest microphone.
This reads like you’re trying to balance your influence with rich people in the tech community who like Elon while hedging your bets as Musk has become increasingly deranged and extreme in his antics. We can all agree with you that Spacex and Tesla are great, but his unmitigated embrace of far-right politics is hitting the pointing where there’s no need to qualify criticisms and deep distrust of him. It’s up to him to prove that his intentions are good, he doesn’t deserve the benefit of the doubt anymore.
The Left's sudden obsession with Elon is really weird. Elon Musk is NOT "making critical decisions about the United States". He is not making ANY govt decisions at all. Even as the head of DOGE (stupid acronym for a stupid idea) he will not have any official power. Elon Musk is an advisor; presidential advisors (incl wealthy ones) are nothing new.
"Elon spent $250M to get Trump elected" -- oh heavens to Betsy, what will he get for that money?
George Soros (another billionaire) spent $500M+ in 2018 and 2019, mostly to elect local DAs. What did he get for his money? The disaster that was "defund the police" -- what, you thought that idea was totally organic and grassroots? Astroturf backed by political violence.
Let's not even talk about the Pritzkers. Oh, you thought the "men can get pregnant" thing was organic too? That America suddenly forget basic biology in the last 5 years entirely spontaneously? Astroturf backed with economic and social violence.
Noah, tell me again about all those studies that show American policy reflects the will of the middle-class? What if the middle-class just mirrors (either by emulation or coercion) the lunatic policy preferences of the oligarchy?
The Left is just upset the Right finally has someone with deep pockets willing to defend the country instead of tear it apart for a change.
On a practical level, is anyone actually upset that Elon's whining took a 1500 page bill laden with giveaways and bennies down to a simple 100 page bill that just funds the government? He didn't even succeed; Trump's debt limit extension got cut too.
Agree, the show on X is just perpetual self-agitation and self-high-fiving of Muskovites that has little relevance in the real world. I doubt even 5% of them called their senators as they claim they did.
The thing that worries me though is that many of Musk supporters cheer whenever Elon says something in a spirit of "all branches of government should align with president". This seems like an empirical confirmation that middle class mirrors preferences of oligarchy. But that means that some kind of a check on oligarchs is needed.
Can we simple say evil Elon is the self-dealing Elon?
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/house-democrat-says-republicans-protecting-elon-musks-chinese-investments-2024-12-20/
Frankly Dr Smith, you are forgetting your American history and missing the obvious. The United States grappled with the equivalent problem between the 1890s and the Great Depression. Back then, the Elons of the world were, correctly, labelled the "Robber Barons". This they were, and the fact that they began, or financed, or exploited, the industrialization and commercialization of the United States, and thus stimulated the great expansion in economic growth and mass prosperity after about the mid-1870s. But they were, collectively, also malevolent bullies who tried to run the country, shifting it in reactionary directions and fostering a particularly nasty triumphalist creed we then called "Social Darwinism". And breaking their power, or a major and public portion of it, was a pre-requisite for the advance of American progress. Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, the Progressive Era and the aggressive use of the antitrust laws was the first salvo, and FDR and the New Deal finished the job, albeit only after the massive and tragic capital destruction of the Great Depression put them on the defensive.
Musk is just the most recent and malignant manifestation of the recurrence of the Robber Barons in American life. Same Social Darwinism and utter indifference to the fate of those less fortunate, although here inflected by an unhealthy dose of vicious Caesarism (thank you, Moldbug) that should frighten any defender of democracy and some particular apartheid-era-South-Africa-flavored baasskap (Google it) philosophy applied to the modern U.S. At least the first-wave Robber Barons built universities and small-town libraries. Social stability is a positive good; "move fast and break things" doesn't work when you're talking about the many major government functions which exist, on the basis of the hard lessons of history, to stabilize society and protect those less able to deploy government favor to protect themselves.
None of this is a new story, although it is deeply dispiriting that the U.S. is apparently going to have to learn again all the lessons of 1890-1965, and that this problem doesn't appear to be clear to someone as bright as Noah Smith.
Rosebud
Elon Musk wouldn’t be chummy with Putin if he wanted stability in Europe.
Trump, who knew about the original CR, clearly approved it. It seems as if Elon went freelancing.
Musk has far more money than Trump. That alone probably bothers Trump. The fact that Elon exercised the power that Trump usually uses will bother Trump.
Trump has created a monster. The wealthiest man in the world has a new toy. Politics. He now imagines he has real power. Something else that Trump will tire of is Musk usurping his power and headlines.
What will happen with a scorned Musk? Bad twitter? I see a big crash between the two coming, and Trump would be wise to figure out how to settle Elon down. Trump and Elon have learned it is hard to herd cats.
The Muskrat aside, I think that Noah’s comments about oligarchy in the US are blindfolded by not including corporations in the equation. Since our esteemed judiciary regards corporations as individuals, isn’t it more realistic to be concerned about an oligarchy that includes both individuals AND corporations and, I think, that’s a very real concern regarding our future. How much of our healthcare cost quagmire, for example, can be attributed to corporations that defend the status quo against attempts at reform? How much of our bloated defense budget is a result of corporate muckraking behind closed doors? Examples are endless.