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Dr. Draper Kauffman's avatar

"At that price we’d be better off just planting a bunch more trees instead."

Ugh. No, we wouldn't. Planting trees doesn't solve anything. If water is flowing into a bathtub faster than it is draining out, you do not solve the problem by making the bathtub slightly bigger. If you don't change the inflow or outflow, a one-time increase in the amount of storage doesn't do anything except very slightly delay the crisis.

Trees are NOT "the lungs of the world." A mature forest is carbon neutral. For trees to work as a carbon sink, you'd have to cut them down as soon as they mature and then preserve the wood in some way so it can't burn or rot. This is simply not a scalable way to reduce carbon flows. It's too slow, it's too expensive, and what do you do with all the leaves, wood, and other debris?

If you want to do bio-extraction, at least do it in a way that makes sense. Grow something cheaper, faster growing, and much easier to sequester. For example, we could grow Azolla on vast shallow ponds adjacent to the Arctic Ocean every summer. Azolla floats and grows insanely fast in 20+hours of sun, with no fertilizer. When the ponds are covered, open the gates and let the whole mass flow out to sea, where it will die in the saltwater and sink to the bottom.

This is how nature did it. It's very probably how we got from "hothouse earth" to the current climate. There's a thick layer of mud at the bottom of the Arctic that is basically a solid mass of preserved Azolla, containing teratonnes of carbon that used to be in the atmosphere.

Once you have shaped the ponds, it pretty much works for free anywhere you have north-flowing rivers and streams. And, unlike adding to the fixed *stock* of carbon in trees, it would increase the annual *flow* of carbon out of the atmosphere.

The international economic effects of such a system would be interesting too. Most of the first world would need to charge a carbon tax or otherwise find a way to pay Russia and Canada to extract and sequester carbon for them, although the U.S. might be able to do much or all of its own carbon extraction and sequestration along the north and northwestern edge of Alaska. Over time, as the West passes carbon neutrality and into negative net carbon flows, it will become politically unacceptable to ask the West to carry the whole burden. At that point, developing nations will need to get to carbon neutrality either through renewable energy or by charging a carbon tax and contributing to the extraction and sequestration process.

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Richard's avatar

This is the optimistic take (which is what I’d expect from you, Noah).

Kevin Drum, seeing absolutely zippo collective progress in decreasing CO2 emissions despite the science showing that climate catastrophe was looming even as far back as the ‘90’s, is far more pessimistic:

https://jabberwocking.com/in-2040-we-will-collectively-decide-to-flood-the-atmosphere-with-aerosols/

He thinks that we’ll have to seed sulfate aerosols to block the sun in coming decades in desperation despite unintended effects.

In general, he’s more optimistic about American democracy but less techno-optimist than you. Maybe because he’s an older guy who has cancer.

In this case, Drum may be more on the money.

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